In the first installment of ?Defining pound for pound? I displayed the first twenty sets of opinions on the heated ?pound for pound? debate. Obviously the recent discussion has become a one on one race between WBO welterweight king Manny Pacquiao and undefeated Floyd Mayweather Jr. Both men have displayed incredible skills with much accomplishments to their name and people seemed split on who to side with.
Many pointed to Pacquiao?s recent run through a very credible list of opposition, with successive wins over Oscar De La Hoya, Ricky Hatton, Miguel Cotto, and Joshua Clottey all occurring in the past year and a half. Pacquiao was dominant in every fight and in those four bouts it?s hard to think of him losing more than a handful of rounds. His willingness to test himself against a dangerous list of opposition while fighting with much tenacity is what endeared him to many members of the panel.
Others, however, were so taken with Mayweather?s virtuoso display against Shane Mosley earlier this month in Las Vegas that they thrust him to the top of their charts. Also pointing to the Grand Rapids fighter?s uncanny ring awareness and remarkable talent in the ring, it is obvious that Floyd?s comeback to the sport is one that has turned a lot of heads while reminding people of his greatness.
In the second waive of opinions on the subject I again received drastically different feedback from more people within the sport. Everyone?s reasoning is again drastically different and the responses are again mixed. Read below for the thoughts of the second panel in the ?pound for pound? argument?
Joseph ?Trouble? Figueroa – 67 fight veteran who went head to head with five former world champions as a professional. To read about Figueroa?s time in camp with Joshua Clottey please click HERE? ?In my humble opinion, this is what a fighter needs to be considered a pound for pound great:
– Consistent level of competition.
– The fashion in which he wins his fights against that competition.
– Activity. (There are of course other miscellaneous things, but I feel that these are the most signifigant.)
Now you asked for it, so here it goes?
I consider Manny Pacquiao to be the best pd 4 pd fighter in the world because of this:
– His level of competition is sick, check his record. He has fought future Hall of Famers like: Morales, Marquez, Barrera, Hatton, DeLaHoya, & Cotto. Half of these guys were naturally way bigger than him.
– He never took 2 years off and considered himself the best in the world. He stayed active.
– He fought in exciting dominating fights.
– When he had his opponent hurt, he got rid of them.
– Manny has not fought a “bunch” of old, small, or washed up guys to stay active. Again, check the record, all live bodies.
– He’s willing to fight anybody. With the rules that Nevada sets in place and inforces, not made up by himself out of fear. (Gotta sneak a few in every now and then). My pick for boxing’s best pound for pound fighter in the world is Manny Pacquiao, until “someone” beats him, and dominates him, he’ll be there. (Heard that, “someone”?)?
Ryan Songalia – BoxingScene contributor and Boxing Digest columnist? ?I would say that ?pound for pound? is the willingness to take on any challenges and seek out the biggest risks while defying expectations.
Over the years you look at a guy like Pernell Whitaker who took on all challenges even if he didn?t always have the promotional backing. Another fighter like Sugar Ray Robinson took on all kinds of challenges. Marvin Hagler also sought out all top challenges. He fought John Mugabi when everyone was afraid of him and gave a young lion his chance. [Thomas] Hearns was another dangerous fight and many people didn?t think he could beat Hearns. Hagler just didn?t care.
Right now I would have to say it is Manny Pacquiao. He was smaller in weight but has continued to exceed expectations. Mayweather fought a lot of tough guys and you can?t take anything from his career. He didn?t fight Winky Wright or Antonio Margarito but at the end of the day he is still standing and they are not. There is no room for 2 pound for pound fighters in the same weight class. It will hurt both of their legacies if they don?t end up fighting. Right now everyone is taking scores and the fight will settle the issue. It?s the type of fight that could thrust boxing back into the limelight for day, months, and even years.?
Scoop Malinowski – Journalist, interviewer, and author for www.TheBiofile.com… ?The term “pound for pound best fighter in the world today” is a vague, ambiguous title which I’ve always felt was more like a popularity contest, such as MVP award for the NFL, NBA or MLB. Very rare is it unanimous that one athlete is the clear-cut very best in the sport. In boxing today it’s also unclear as to who really is the best of all. There are so many worthy candidates.
You have to consider Manny Pacquiao and Floyd Mayweather but they may not even be the best in their own weight class at 147 because it’s very possible that Paul Williams could come back down to 147 and beat them both. Wladimir Klitschko is totally dominating heavyweight boxing right now to the point that he is ending careers (Brock, Ibragimov, Byrd, Chagaev, Austin) – and his top challenger (David Haye) is afraid to fight him. Gamboa of Cuba is a marvel. I like Caballero from Panama too. Sergio Martinez deserves consideration. The potential of Andre Ward – if he keeps getting better, he just may wipe out the super middleweight division.
I believe the best fighter in the sport today is the one atop the flagship division – the heavyweight champion – Wladimir Klitschko who is, by the way, 6-ft, 4 inches tall (he told me this personally after Chuck Wepner told me he was next to Wladimir and said he was shorter than himself – Chuck is 6-5).
The best non-heavyweight boxer in my opinion is either Pacquiao, Mayweather or Williams. There’s only one way to find out who is the best – they have to fight each other and settle it in the ring.?
Steve Forbes – former IBF Jr. Lightweight champion of the world who has spent time in camp with both Pacquiao and Mayweather? ?I think people base pound for pound on just one or let?s say two or perhaps three performances. Pound for pound should be based on a career of great accomplishments, and I think Mayweather has done just that. I think if there’s a class for the most exciting fighter and beloved action hero than Manny Pacquiao wins but if we go by sheer consistency then it has to be Mayweather. All he has done is win and pretty easily.?
Kenneth Ragpala – 8 Count News correspondent? ?The level of opposition a fighter has fought and won against is a huge factor in determining who is pound for pound best. But it does not end in how high or low the quality and weight divisions of opponents a fighter has fought, one must also take into consideration the fashion of his victories over such opposition.
Manny Pacquiao still remains the best fighter pound for pound. If we are to look at his past three fights, Pacquiao fought the best available fighters there is. Ricky Hatton was considered the top dog at 140. Miguel Cotto and Joshua Clottey are in the top 5 of the welterweight list.
On the contrary, Floyd Mayweather has fought twice since his return and one can simply argue his win over Juan Manuel Marquez, though very dominant, could not possibly earn him a spot since he fought an aging lightweight who was way beyond his comfort zone. Money’s win over Mosley, although very impressive, is not enough to take Pacquiao’s spot.?
Coyote Duran – Managing editor for www.MaxBoxing.com ?To me, these days, pound-for-pound status is nothing more than a fun way to get the tongues wagging between fans and has somewhat drifted away from its original mission, when Sugar Ray Robinson was the king of the hill. However, if I may be Devil’s Advocate, I think what makes a fighter the best fighter in the world- or pound-for-pound best- is his willingness to get out there and run headlong into the big challenges and fight the other best fighters in the world, while facing the best in your own natural weight classes. It goes beyond saying, “I’m the best fighter in the world.” It depends on how one goes about proving it.
The best fighter in the world today, in my humble opinion, is Manny Pacquiao. However, to be honest, Pacquiao hasn’t fulfilled my criteria to its fullest extent lately. This isn’t to say he hasn’t been shaking up things at welterweight, but he’s certainly could’ve done a lot more at lightweight and junior welterweight. There really is a lot of unfinished business (of you could even call it not-even-started-business) at 135 and 140 and, for a guy who hasn’t vacated THE RING’s World 140-pound title, he sure hasn’t done what he needs to stake a solid claim to the belt, when you’ve got guys like Tim Bradley and Devon Alexander still laying down the groove there. On the other hand, where Floyd Mayweather Jr. (who I totally consider the #2 fighter in the world) validates a tune-up against a blown-up lightweight in Juan Manuel Marquez, Manny Pacquiao did go to 147 to take on relative danger in Oscar De La Hoya, dropped to 140 to destroy Ricky Hatton, went back to 147, dispatching real live welterweights in Miguel Cotto and Joshua Clottey. If Pacquiao can get past his issue with Olympic-style drug testing- whether it has to do with a genuine fear of needles or just plain obstinacy- and Mayweather defeats him, Floyd has it, lock, stock and barrel.
You might find this funny, but I think Paul Williams has the same pound-for-pound recipe Pacquiao does but he’s not moved in the right direction or in markets where he can excel. Ideologically, “The Punisher” and the “Pac-Man” are rather similar!?
Allan Green – Super Middleweight contender getting ready for his June 19th showdown with WBA champion Andre Ward? ?To me, a pound for pound fighter is somebody who beats all of the top threats in his division. I?m not talking about who the media says is the best, I mean the real threats near his weight class.
Right now I would have to say Floyd Mayweather is the best fighter since he just beat Shane Mosley.?
Aladdin Freeman, ESPN Correspondent and contributor to www.BraggingRightsCorner.com ?For me to be pound for pound is to be the best in the discussion of that “mythical” weight division where you match all the fighters up and see who would win. To be the best in that “division” you’d need an array of skills: Defense, speed, power, footwork, and the ability to deal with adversity and fight your way through it… In others, you’d need to be a complete prize fighter. There have been plenty of times in recent history where we have a fighter on the list and they end up flawed in certain areas. Prince Hamed had bone jarring power yet when he fought Marco Antonio Barrera he couldn’t hurt him and really he had a tough enough time even hitting him. Fernando Vargas was considered a beast going into the Felix Trinidad fight (even if he did get outclassed by Winky Wright) early in his career. While Vargas did show a ton of heart vs. Trinidad, in the long run that fight probably ruined him.
I’d say Floyd Mayweather Jr. is pound for pound the best…big surprise there I bet. I can really only think of a handful of fights where he was even in a completive fight. Burton gave him a go for a while. I thought Jose Luis Castillo won the first fight but the rematch was so lopsided it had me wanting to go back a check the first fight. The Oscar De La Hoya fight was a close fight but again most people felt while Oscar could have used his jab more in the fight, there was a good reason he didn’t. Even when rocked like he was against Mosley, Floyd was able to right the ship and go on to win the next 10 rounds. I also remember Chop-Chop Corley hitting Floyd on the button and hurting him, again Mayweather Jr. was able to compose himself and go on to victory.
Like him or hate him, you have to give the man credit. He’s the most complete fighter to come around in a long time. The only thing he doesn’t have is that 1 punch knock-out power. That being said I’d pick him to beat Manny Pacquiao. Besides the fact that I believe Manny is cheating, just from a fight stand point I believe Floyd would be so juiced (bad choice of words) to stop Manny that it’d get ugly in a hurry. I don’t like to compare fights but Manny and Marquez was dead even, I still believe Marquez got jobbed. Floyd completely shut out Marquez. So much so that people were booing him.
So in my eyes, right now Floyd Mayweather Jr. is the king in regards to pound for pound.?
Vivek Wallace – East Side Boxing and Examiner correspondent ?In text book definition, the term Pound-for-Pound meant pure transcendent talent that establishes greatness at any level with all things remaining equal. Lately, the meaning has been changed to encompass popularity, but in my book, a high ring IQ and strong fundamental skills will always equate to unequivocal greatness. I say that because I’ve seen fighters with a low ring IQ and better-than-average talent find themselves stunted due to poor fundamentals (think Zahir Raheem); and I’ve seen lesser overall talent with an amazing ring IQ and pure fundamentals walk away with amazing success (think Bernard Hopkins).
Fighters like Shane Mosley and Manny Pacquiao are crowd faves because of their huge heart and fan-friendly style of mixing it up, but considering that they use very little defense, if they were born heavyweights, considering how easy it is to hit them, can one really assume they’d find the same level of success in a division with thunderous punchers who are more powerful than they are? Fundamental skills offset power, (as seen in Mayweather/Mosley or Martinez/Pavlik), this is why I value fundamental skills and a high ring IQ. Not only do they allow you to hit more and be hit less, but a strong ring IQ to support those fundamentals allows you to employ these attributes at the precise moment in the precise manner
I think it all depends on how you view the term “best”. Manny Pacquiao has the heart of a lion. So with his warrior style and ability to take that huge heart up in weight with him, it’s hard to deny him this title. But when you look at the fundamental ability of Floyd Mayweather jr. and what he does statistically, it’s hard to deny anyone who places him at the top of this list, as well. Mayweather allowed ODH to throw 106 more punches, yet he landed 85 more.
He came back from a 2yr layoff and set a compubox plus/minus record of +47 by landing at 59%, and holding a P4P top 5 fighter in Marquez down to a pathetic 12%. This same Marquez landed at 34% against Pacquiao, (who uses very little defense), which is why the results weren’t as conclusive in either fight. That’s pure offensive fundamentals (hitting) and pure defense fundamentals (not getting hit). With that statistical domination, it’s easy to see why many find Mayweather to be boring. I think either man can be labeled the best. Just depends on what you like. Slugfest, or fundamental skills.?
Rashad Holloway – Welterweight contender getting ready for a May 28th bout in Norfolk, Virgina. To further ready Holloway?s thoughts on a Pacquiao vs. Mayweather matchup click HERE… ?Being pound for pound for me isn’t always about talent. It?s the fighter that tests himself amongst the best because he dares to be great. We lack that now because of the promoters and number of belts. In the glory days there was one title and the best had to fight the best. Now there are more ways to be a World Champ which brings more options to make money and better lives for us fighter but there are still some throwbacks out there.
People are gonna say I’m bias but I’d have to say Manny and so would anyone else. He’s moved up in weight with no tune ups and dominated who was considered the best in those divisions. Floyd’s number 2 in my book with all the ability to take that spot. The question is will he. One of the most talented boxers this games ever seen but the more I sit back and analyze it he’s just a smart business man so I don’t knock him.?
Paris Barnhill – writer for www.OfficialScorecard.com… ?In my oppinion i think the pound for pound best has to fight the best fighters in his division and beat them decisively. The fighter does not have to an undefeated record but has to demonstrate the physical and mental ability to deal with adversity. I honestly think floyd is the p4p in my eyes. He has proven over the last decade his status as being the best and has not been dethroned or hardly even tested in the ring.?
Chris Cozzone – Photojournalist and www.Fightnews.com contributor… ?Wins over top opposition ;domination in a particular weight class – and ability to move up divisions with similar success; natural talent, boxing skills and a warrior’s heart.
Best fighter in the world today is Manny Pacquiao, followed (very) closely by Floyd Mayweather. Pacquiao has dominated opposition and moved up several divisions in doing so. Best BOXER may be Floyd, but best fighter is Manny.?
Aaron Williams – Cruiserweight contender who was recently seen sparring John Ruiz in order to help him get ready for his bout with David Haye? ?A fighter who dominates their weight class and has fought everybody.
I think Mayweather is the best fighter today. He beat everbody in his era.?
Darrell Jones – Undefeated Welterweight prospect from Philadelphia? ?I think to be p4p best is about winning, who you are winning against and how long you stay on the list. To me Floyd Mayweather is the best p4p fighter in the world. Ever since he beat Diego Corrales in 2001 I think he has been in the top 5 and since then he beat some solid guys from 130-154 and he just keeps winning.?
Ryan Bates – 411 Mania correspondent and radio host of ?3 More Rounds?? ?Basically it comes down to this: The spectacular show against Mosley finally (FINALLY) put some meat onto that “undefeated” argument, but it doesn’t negate the fact that Manny has won seven world titles in seven different weight classes, which essentially is the definition of pound for pound, right? So on my personal pound-for-pound list, I have a tie for first place. “Oh you can’t do that, it’s a list!” It’s a mythical pound-for-pound list. I could put Wooldoor Sockbat on there if I wanted to. In my eyes, Manny is the best in the game, and I think still beats Floyd, but Floyd has laid claim to the number 1 position as well, and the ONLY way to resolve it is to have the guys fight.?
Ben ?Hype? Thompson ? Editor and owner of www.FightHype.com ?In my opinion, the “pound-for-pound” best fighter in the world is the guy who I think could beat anyone, regardless of weight division, in a mythical match-up. While accomplishments are great, I don’t think that should be the primary basis for deciding if Fighter A is better than Fighter B in terms of P4P rankings. For example, just because Manny Pacquiao has better names on his resume than say Wladimir Klitschko, that doesn’t necessarily mean that he should be ranked higher in someone’s P4P list. For me, what it boils down to is skill, style and talent, so if Manny Pacquiao actually did step into the ring with Wladimir Klitschko and, hypothetically, they were fighting at the same weight, I think Pacquiao’s skill, style and talent would get him a win over Klitschko…therefore, I rank Pacquiao higher than Klitschko based on the match-up as opposed to their accomplishments. I think far too many writers look at past and present accomplishments to make their decision. That’s the reason why you get a guy like Jermain Taylor or Ricky Hatton rated so high in a P4P list based off of one win when, in reality, they probably never should have cracked the Top 10 in the first place.
By far, hands down, Floyd Mayweather is the best pound-for-pound fighter in the world today. He does pretty much EVERYTHING right and makes very few mistakes and if I were to match him up with anyone, regardless of weight, I just don’t see him losing. I’ve never seen him pressed or bothered in a fight…NEVER…not even when Mosley rocked him, whereas I’ve seen just about every other fighter in tooth-and-nail close fights at one point or another. Mayweather’s style has proven to be EXTREMELY difficult to figure out and, as of now, I don’t see anyone being able to come up with a solution, no matter what weight division they fight in. If Mayweather were to fight Chad Dawson, Sergio Martinez or Ivan Calderon, assuming weight was not a factor, I think he beats them all on the strength of his skill and style. I’m not so sure the same can be said for Manny Pacquiao, who I’ve seen in tough fights against guys with similar, and yet less effective, styles. On the contrary, I have yet to see Floyd Mayweather struggle with any style placed in front of him. So who’s the best fighter in the world today? That’s easy work?Floyd Mayweather Jr.?
David Estrada – Welterweight contender last seen rejuvenating his career with a viscous beat down on previously undefeated Orlando Lora this past April in Rancho Mirage, California? ?For me pound for pound best means being a champ and defending your titles against the best in the world…in other words, not ducking anybody. A perfect example would be Mosley. As far as who I feel is pound for pound today…Pacquiao.?
Aaron Skinner – Florida based correspondent for www.8CountNews.com… ?I think it?s about who fights the best and beats the best. It doesn?t matter what weight class either, although the Heavyweight division certainly has lost some attention. I think the Welterweight division has a lot of history to it and it is very deep again with Mayweather, Pacquiao, Mosley, Cotto, and others.
I think Floyd Mayweather is the best. Pacquiao is a great fighter but who did he actually beat? He beat an old De La Hoya, who hasn?t had a meaningful win in years. Clottey was a good win and Cotto was a good win but neither are on the level of Mayweather beating Mosley. Mayweather beat Marquez decisively yet Pacquiao struggled with Marquez twice.?
Jake Donovan – Feature columnist for Boxing Scene… ?Too many people take too literally the mythical part of “pound-for-pound” to where often left out of the equation is actual achievement. It was the mistake often made in the late ’90’s, allowing Roy Jones to sit on his lead forever, while other top pound-for-pound entrants were actually getting criticized for losing close, tough fights against fellow top opposition.
Yes, a part of it should be A beats B if we pretend they are the same size. But it has to be based far more on achievement than potential.
Based on my response to the earlier question, you have to keep Pacquiao at the top. Make no mistake, Floyd’s virtuoso performance against Shane makes the race 1 and 1a. I don’t argue with anyone’s take that has Floyd beating Pacquiao if/when they eventually fight. But until that happens, you can’t take ONE noteworthy performance by Floyd in 2 1/2 years (sorry, the welterweight-blubbered Marquez sparring session doesn’t count) and have it trump everything that Manny has accomplished in recent years.
Should Mayweather sustain this level of competition and perform on a similar level, then of course you have to give him much stronger consideration. But until more fights against top fighters in and above his weight class take place, let’s not call it a trend just yet. A fight on the level of Mosley is something that should’ve been happening during his stay as welterweight king, instead of watching everyone else fight each other.
Short of Mayweather actually beating Pacquiao – or moving up and beating Paul Williams or Sergio Martinez – the pound-for-pound title remains Pacquiao’s to lose in my opinion?
Thomas Hauser – widely respected boxing author who has covered the sport extensively of the years while always giving his readers a behind-the-scenes look at everything. Hauser?s work can be found at www.SecondsOut.com and his latest article on Floyd Mayweather can be found HERE… ?They guy who does the most to beat the best available competition.
Manny Pacquiao?
Second round tallies Manny Pacquiao 9 votes Floyd Mayweather 8 votes Wladimir Klitschko 1 vote Undecided 2 votes
Total tallies through two rounds Floyd Mayweather 18 votes Manny Pacquiao 17 votes Wladimir Klitschko 1 vote Undecided 4 votes
To read the first set of opinions on the pound for pound debate please click HERE
For a picture by picture look at Manny Pacquiao and Floyd Mayweather throughout the years please click on the collage or slideshow below?
