Tungod, Inabanga, Bohol – A few years back, when I was just starting to get seriously hooked with the sweet science of boxing, the passion, spontaneity, and vast knowledge, coupled with uncanny historical accounting, among some of the sport?s most avid followers never failed to amaze me. Funny as it may seem, my initial intention for engaging in discussions at ringtalk.com?s message boards and pacland forums was just to practice my communication skills with people who had English as their native tongue. Little did I expect how these people would serenely influence my personal view of the sport. It?s like a cult, actually, and later on, I would end up being one of the sports? loyal followers as well. When I was a kid, I used to think that boxing was a barbaric and uncivilized sport, where intelligent conversations can least be expected. Now that I have looked a little bit closer and had some interesting chats with a few of the better boxing minds, I have come to realize that there?s more to boxing than normally meets the casual fan?s eye. Boxing, indeed is a system? a body of knowledge based on facts and principles. It is a science ? the sweet science!
In this column, we will try something different. Instead of myself, doing all the talking (or writing to be technically correct), I am just going to share a correspondence from Gary Lodge from Oakdale Minnesota, USA. It is my ardent hope that you would also learn a few things from him as I have. He?s been following the sport for many years now and him being there during those Duran days, should make for a very reliable pundit. Being witness to both fighters Pacquiao and Duran, gives him a better perspective than perhaps majority of us. Without much further ado, here goes his correspondence to yours truly?
Reylan, it’s very tricky to try to compare great fighters of different eras. Here is a small list of what made Duran great, and why almost always you see the word “legendary” before his name:
He fought competitively professionally from the age of 18 I believe to age 50. I saw his last pro fight in person, the only time I ever saw him in person.
He started as a bantamweight or super bantamweight I think, ended as super middleweight.
He was lightweight champion in a tough era, for SEVEN years! He is regarded by most respected boxing historians as the greatest lightweight ever in history.
At age 29 or 30, he skipped Jr. Welter division and went straight to Welter 147, after a couple tuneups fought and defeated Sugar Ray Leonard over 15 rounds. I saw the fight on closed circuit screen PPV. People felt Leonard couldn’t be beat. Leonard was only 23 or so, a superstar. Back then, a light guy like Duran who already had a million fights and wars was the underdog.
Duran was a huge underdog going for Jr. Middle championship against young inexperienced Davey Moore. You saw the fight I sent you. Duran brutalized him.
Personally, I think what cements Duran in history is his loss to one of the great middleweights ever, Marvin Hagler. Duran stood with awesome Hagler, used his cunning and speed and nearly won. He lost on the cards the last two rounds of a 15 round fight against one of the most awesome MIDDLEWEIGHTS ever.
A few years later he shocked everyone at age 37 or 38 by engageing in the fight of the year, beating legit Middleweight Champ Iran Barkley, even knocking Barkley down in round 11 of 12.
But, it’s not Pac’s fault he wasn’t born in that era. I argue with guys all the time over this: How do you compare Pac to Duran when Pac never ever had to go the championship distance of 15 rounds? It’s not his fault. It’s safe to say in my opinion that Duran would have KO’d every guy Pac has faced, period. Anyone who came at Duran to fight was lost. Hatton would have been smashed. Morales no chance. I DO think prime Barrera would have given Duran a good fight.
Duran could get frustrated a bit with “runners”, and a few took him the distance in his prime (20s and very early 30s). Duran was great in spite of a big flaw, which was Duran liked to party, and between fights would blow up to nearly 190 and then train. How much greater would Duran have been if he had the constant work ethic Pac has?
No current fighter ever had to go the championship distance. The championship distance is 15 rounds. There is a HUGE difference between round 12 and round 15. Only championship fights were 15 rounds, all others were 10 or 12. There were very few “bogus” champs like most are today. Berto is a bogus champ and it’s an insult to boxing he is considered a champion. He might be a nice guy and dedicated, but please, Duran would have KO’d him using just one arm, and I’m not kidding.
Now I mean no disrespect to Pac. He has done ALL that could be asked of a boxer of today’s generation. He never ducked anyone. He beat everybody! He’s been a good example and inspiration. He never tarnished boxing like Floyd, who makes a joke of boxing regardless of how technically skilled he is. Pac is a fighter! Pac is a Warrior. Pac cares if he loses. He takes it personal. He’s not afraid of anyone.
You have to compare how Pac would have done against Duran by first comparing them prime for prime always. Take the Duran as lightweight champ and put him in against prime lightweight Pac. Pac comes at Duran and he get’s KOd. If Pac boxes and moves like Sugar Ray Leonard or younger Floyd or Sweet Pea Whittaker and he has a little more problem but overcomes it. Duran had more dimensions to his game I believe.
And, to be fair, from what I have heard, pound for pound, Ray Robinson was better than Duran.
I roll my eyes when I read people refer to Pac as all time greatests. No. Not greater than Duran. Not greater than Robinson. Not greater than Ali, none of those guys. It’s an unknown really, if Pac were fighting in the 70s, he probably would be greater than he is now, just due to how often guys fought, and the level of competition he would have had to fight. Plus, he would have had to fight 15 rounds if needed. Think about it, would the outcome of both Pacs fights with Marquez have been different had they been real championship fights, 15 rounds? My gut says Marquez would have pulled out most of those rounds.
Reylan, you really would have had to live and experience the boxing of the 70s and early to mid 80s. I don’t know if Pac beats Julio Chavez. Chavez was really good. I don’t think Pac could beat Sweet Pea in his prime. I honestly think Duran would have been too frustrated by Sweet Pea Whittaker and probably dropped decision to him. I didn’t like Sweet Pea at the time. I sometimes would turn off the TV if he fought. But styles make fights.
In a shootout, which Duran vs Pac would be, I would bet on Duran every time. Just my humble opinion. Put Pac in a time machine back to Duran’s era, I believe Pac would out war anyone Duran fought at lightweight, including DeJesus who was great. But Duran was something different. Again, much respect to Pac, he’s been my favorite fighter to watch for many years now and I admire him greatly. He makes me think of Duran who I miss very much.
I will say that I don’t think Pac would be intimidated by Duran, and anytime you go against a Southpaw with power, anything can happen!
Duran was a icon of his time, just like Ray Robinson was for his. Pac has been for this past decade and today. Floyd isn’t on the same plane as Pac. Pac enjoys a risk. He’s a fighter, like Duran. Floyd’s goal is protecting Floyd. Pacs goal is to knock guys out, take chances, be a role model, be a pretty good family guy and good representative of his country and boxing in general. Floyd doesn’t even come close. Duran was to Panama what Pac is for your country, and it’s great.
As far as my opinion goes, you have a point but keep in mind I grew up with Duran, he was young when I was young, so I grew up watching him, and Ali for example. I have tremendous nostalgia towards them, and bias. I also believe people can make a better judgement about a fighter’s legacy years after they have left the ring. Duran’s legacy grew, and so will Pacs. 15 years from now hopefully there will be new and more stars, and we will be wondering how Pac would have done against them!
Let me know your opinion sir!
Gary Lodge
Oakdale, Minnesota, USA
Read more: http://www.bukisa.com/articles/388285_pacquiao-duran-and-some-serious-thoughts-from-a-very-faithful-follower-of-the-sport-episode-1#ixzz14MhCS7Ee
